The two filmmakers sit next to each other on a sofa in a space so small it could have been a caravan.
- It's our hiding place, says Yuval Abraham and laughs.
- No, but it is some kind of flat in London, where we are still located, says Rachel Szor.
They constantly speak as a unit, filling in each other's sentences and waiting for each other's reactions. The interview is done via link because the security situation is as it is: difficult.
Since the film was screened to a standing ovation at the Venice Film Festival, discussion about it has exploded, especially in Israel. Despite the fact that it has not been shown in the country and that few have seen it, everyone has an opinion.
- Of course we understood that there would be reactions, but it was difficult to imagine how quickly it would escalate. That the Prime Minister goes out and makes several statements about the film and the enormous hatred that flows towards us, says Yuval Abraham.
Rachel Szor nods.
- It is clear that it is tough with the backlash, but I think our biggest fear was that the film would go completely unnoticed. That it would be ignored, just as all reports from Palestinian journalists have been. You know, any Israeli just needs to open their phone to see what is happening in Gaza, there is plenty of documentation. It's not like it really takes the testimony of Israeli soldiers to understand.
They both hope that the film will be a first step for Israeli society to stop "living in denial". That the raging debate should nevertheless sow the seeds to get more people to start getting involved in what is happening.
"Naza" is a documentary film based on, among other things, 24 in-depth interviews with Israeli intelligence officers. They talk, under the cover of darkness on a roof in Tel Aviv, about how the military decides which houses in Gaza to bomb. "Naza" is the word for a person who is killed without being the primary target. Civilians, innocents, family members, women and children.
- I have witnessed a house with over 500 people being bombed, says one of the soldiers.
- There are perhaps 100 purely military targets in Gaza, but there are many private homes. 40,000 military targets means 40,000 houses, says another.
One of the soldiers talks about how the Israeli Defense Force, the IDF, hacks mobile phones and can thus listen inside the houses. Both before and after an attack.
- It was one of the things that scared me the most. You think that these intelligence officers are sitting behind their screens and don't know exactly what they are going to bomb. But then he tells how he could hear a family inside a house, a baby, a TV on, a couple arguing. You understand how much they know before they bomb, says Rachel Szor.
She very much wants to go home to Israel. More than Yuval wants, but he too wants to go home for the Israeli elections at the end of October. In Israel, you can only vote if you are in the country.
They hope the opposition center and left voters who spend every weekend demonstrating against Netanyahu will see the film. The secular middle-class Israelis who come from the same background as Abraham and Szor themselves.
- We want to put this mirror in front of that group and ask how they can continue to protest against Netanyahu and at the same time participate in, or remain silent about, the mass murder of children. Striving to preserve Israel's democracy, but not at any time in the last three years protesting the abuses that human rights organizations describe as acts of genocide, says Rachel Szor.
- I think there is a contradiction in this and we know it is a tough debate, but we hope that there are people within this group, our own group, who wake up. We believe in change. All people can change, says Yuval Abraham.
- We are not the same people we were ten years ago, says Rachel Szor.
Read more:
Netanyahu wants to see film actors on trial
Review: "Naza" is a chilling document about the deadly cynicism of the Gaza war
