We talk a lot about the train, but how is the bus sector and what does Direbús represent within it?
Direbús represents small and medium-sized businesses, mostly all discretionary services. Little regular [transport], unfortunately, because regular transportation is very conditioned, very monopolized by the conditions required to operate lines such as long-distance lines. Only large companies that have been subsidized by the Government for decades, from both parties, can access it.
What contribution do small and medium-sized companies in the coach sector make?
Our main source of income is tourism. Discretionary companies, which no one knows and which are so poorly covered, move 90% of the tourism that arrives in Spain. The soccer teams come, they pick them up at the airport and take them, all of them. To all the tourists who visit Madrid of all types of nationalities... The problem with the discretionary sector is that it is a very atomized sector. It is becoming more professional, but we have to advance a little more. If we joined forces, like taxi drivers, we would do a lot of damage. We can stop, not a city like taxi drivers, we can stop the entire country. Shall I tell you how the father or mother would be if the school route does not pass in five days? They would tear their hair out. We would unsettle society in five days. If this does not change and a new Administration does not improve, problems will begin.
The conditions of regular long-distance transport to which they do not have access are established when granting the concessions to operate the different lines, now subject to a renewal process that, for the first time, includes Transport funds to exclusively operate unprofitable routes. What do you think?
The Ministry commissioned a report from Ineco, which depends on it, and which said that the concession system was bad and expensive. I'm not saying it, the statistics say it. We have recently seen the opening of the market in Portugal, the number of shipments that have opened and the price has dropped, the service has improved. [The opening] prevents depopulation, which is so worrying in Spain, but we talk about it only halfway. A concessional map does not help prevent cities from being depopulated. We are stuck in a 1987 law, it needs to be modernized and harmonized.
Do small and medium-sized coach companies have any possibility of accessing any concessions?
What should have been done is what European regulations say. In Brussels there is a procedure open for cabotage, in which the Government is against it. The European Commission and we are also in favor.
The Ministry of Transport has been avoiding a sentence for not allowing cabotage by starting to comply with one of the exemptions, renewing concessions...
Some have been put out to tender, not all, but the procedure is still open. [Passenger transport by coach] is liberalized in Europe in all countries except Poland, the Czech Republic, Hungary and Spain. In Portugal it has been released and there is much more service. Here we have a concessional problem. Badajoz, for example, does not have a train line. And there is only one operator, Avanza. And it is deficient. If we allowed cabotage, the Madrid-Lisbon vehicle could stop to pick up and drop off people in Badajoz or Cáceres and the population of Extremadura would have communication and that would help against depopulation.
To what do you attribute the Ministry's close support of the concessional system?
It has been like this historically, but what has happened now has already been egregious. We are very concerned because there has never been a waste of money on transportation like now. Left and right with subsidies to companies that gives rise to unfair competition. It cannot be that to operate a loss-making line the father State gives money from our taxes. And then, these companies enter into discretionary services in contests to which they present prices 35 and 40% below the market, with which we cannot compete. At Direbús we are considering going to the Court of Accounts to verify if all that money that goes to transport is true that it reaches transport, to audit the projects that are given in subsidies. We used to like Puente, he's a clear guy. But he disappointed us when he began to defend the concessional system, when he knows very well that this is obsolete.
Renfe should soon present the new specifications for its participating bus company, to have cars to transport its passengers if there is a breakdown or works on the network. What should change regarding the search for a partner among companies that have 500 vehicles, have a turnover of 75 million or have a presence in half of Spain?
We completely distrust this company, which is unviable. The president of Renfe has entered a garden that is going to end badly, he is not going to create any company because, if not, it will be a catastrophe of demonstrations and protests at the doors of the Ministry by the 2,400 discretionary service companies. I'll give you an example, you have a restaurant and the Minister of Hospitality arrives and says that she is going to set up a chain of restaurants for families in need. What would the hoteliers' association say? Which is a very serious incompetence. Well, that's what discretionary transport companies have been suffering for 30 years. A Land Transportation Management Law and a National Passenger Transportation Committee tailored to large companies. It is an irregularity but we are going to correct it, we are going to request it when the new Administration comes in. When it comes, or if it continues, we will raise it.
Renfe argues that with a company you would avoid having to pay for emergency buses at much higher prices because when you need them you do not have the negotiating capacity. Does that happen?
That's not true. In any case, if I call at twelve at night to request five coaches and the next day those coaches have services, we have to modify the service, call collaborators at twelve or one o'clock to be able to send the cars that have been requested for the train. How do they want us to charge them, to give it to them? But it doesn't pay to create a structure. They weren't going to buy a bus there. They were going to carry out a covert nationalization of Alsa and Avanza. Out of cronyism and colleagues. What's happening is that the employers have gotten serious.
Renfe says it is moving forward with specifications that adapt to the risks to competition seen by the Central Administrative Court. How should I do it?
We asked to modify the specifications by zones. A small company with 10 or 12 cars will always give you better service than a large one. All Renfe incidents will always be better attended to by a medium or small company. Ask to have 500 cars? Do not ask for a minimum number. If you don't have cars, you can't handle an incident. I just finished a Madrid-Palencia for 25 days [with his company, Tabor Group]. Furthermore, the tenders [for Adif works on the railway network, which make the alternative bus service necessary] are already ending. There is not much left to do, at most a year. And then what do you do with drivers, the traffic chief, with all those buses. They are going to do discretionary services at a low price. We say that they were only in batches.
We ended last year with the warning that there were school routes from public schools that were not being renewed because the prices offered by the administrations were low, also as a warning to other communities where contracts will expire in a few years. In what situation has the course started now?
In Jaén they have not started the course [there is no route]. At least they have to pay 500-600 euros per day for each bus and they are negotiating. It happens in the Basque Country and it is happening a lot. They will have to pay the corresponding increase and if they are not willing to pay there will be problems with school transportation, as is already happening.
Before you criticized the subsidies, what do you think of the Verano Joven program that reduces train and bus tickets for passengers between 18 and 30 years old and that is a success every summer?
Subsidies are good but in excess they are very bad. Subsidize transportation for people in need, yes. But to them, not to the companies. It is true that all administrations have subsidized, but not like the current one does. The money that is being distributed is sadistic. What I would do is release everything. And whatever is discovered, put it out to tender. And subsidize it. Do you know the amount of money that regular lines cost the Administration?
In the battle for the liberalization of passenger transport by coach, the SMEs associated with Direbús go hand in hand with giants like Flixbus. If they succeed, wouldn't they still be at the mercy of a large company...?
Flixbus is a platform and you can work for it. Like the one that subcontracts with Alsa or Avanza, who subcontract a lot. They collect 10 euros from the Government and pay collaborators 1.2 euros and four months. That's not right, man, the time of slaves has passed.
They see all these issues as a threat to coach SMEs, what would happen if they end up disappearing?
It is happening that large companies are eating small ones and large ones are surpassing their profits. How can they not do it, if the most productive market that the investment funds that own them have is Spain. They reach the Spanish market, they provide for the English at the cost of destroying the Spanish companies. We are in an electoral campaign and everything stops, but we hope that when there are elections and the next Administration comes, we want to start working on this from another perspective. I don't know what Administration will come. Frankly, let's hope the PSOE doesn't come.
But the PP has also rejected the liberalization of the sector for years. Like the PSOE, it voted in favor of eliminating the article that it referred to in the Sustainable Mobility Law...
Indeed, the PP also voted in favor [of eliminating it]. They removed it. We are already a little fed up with politicians, but if the PP arrives we will have a chance. Maybe something. After two months we will see if the door closes again or can be opened.
